WP 23 | Mindset Kool-Aid (the good kind & the bad) with Jane Carter
In this episode of Wise Practice, Whitney Owens and Jane Carter discuss the concept of mindset and its impact on therapy practice owners. You don’t have to drink the bad Kool-Aid.
Running a Therapy Office will Bring up Fears
Carter emphasizes that starting and running a business will bring up all your fears, stories, assumptions about yourself, shame, and other related issues. Therefore, business owners must work on their mindset and figure out how to manage these problems. Carter suggests that business owners should see their practices as a place to grow, work through their issues, fulfill their potential, and discover their purpose. The advice is that having a positive mindset is crucial for success, but it's important to be aware of negative mindsets that can lead to unhealthy patterns or behaviors, such as drinking the "bad" Kool-Aid.
Business Challenges Refine Us
Carter and Owens believe that God uses the challenges and obstacles of running a business to refine us and make us new. Business owners can see their struggles and triumphs as a chance to grow and shape who they are. "There is nothing like starting and running a business to make all your stuff come up." However, Carter warns that it's also possible to become more entrenched in old ways of thinking or even go down some unfortunate paths in business.
Use Self-Reflection and Self-Awareness in Managing Mindset
The episode emphasizes the importance of self-reflection and awareness in managing mindset. Carter suggests that practice owners should reflect on who they want to be in their business and in life. "When my stuff comes up, can I see that as a gift from God?" Business owners must understand that their mindset shapes their decisions and actions. Therefore, they should seek help, build supportive relationships, and surround themselves with individuals who share similar goals and values.
In conclusion, the episode highlights that mindset plays a significant role in the success of therapy practice owners. It's crucial to reflect on oneself, manage negative thoughts and feelings, and focus on personal and business growth. "If you go in with your eyes open, knowing...this is one arena where God could impact who I am and where I could grow in the ways I wanna grow." By doing so, practice owners can build a thriving and fulfilling practice that aligns with their goals and values.
Links and Resources
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WP 23 | Mindset Kool-Aid (the good kind & the bad) with Jane Carter
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Whitney Owens: Welcome back to The Wise Practice Podcast. I'm really looking forward to hanging out with you guys today and for our special guest, Jane Carter. The Jane Carter coaching. Not only is she an amazing coach, but has been a dear friend of mine over the years, as she has been a support and a strength for me through many ups and downs in personal life and business.
Whitney Owens: So I'm excited to introduce you guys to her. So Jane is located in Asheville, North Carolina in the beautiful. Mountains. Not only is she a professional counselor and sees clients in her private practice, but she is also a coach going on eight plus years of coaching therapists. So when I think of Jane, I feel like she was on the cutting edge when coaching started in the private practice world.
Whitney Owens: And so I feel honored to be able to have her on the show today. So
Jane Carter: how you doing? Oh, great. I'm so glad to be back on the show.
Whitney Owens: Yay.
Jane Carter: Yeah. Well it's so great to talk to you again too. Cause our friendship really started with a podcast episode. It was the first time we had talked and it's been so fun to develop this friendship.
Jane Carter: So, yay. I'm glad to be.
Whitney Owens: Yes. Oh, gosh. Well, I appreciate you saying that. That reminds me, I remember you emailed me and was like, Hey, I heard about you threw somebody, and your podcast is awesome. I'd love to come on the show. And I remember thinking, oh my gosh, Jane Carter wants to come on my show. Like, I thought I was the coolest thing ever.
Whitney Owens: And so I just love that, that we've developed that friendship.
Jane Carter: I know. Yay. And I'll add, you've seen, seen me through some ups and downs in the, in the last year or so. Yes. Whitney's.
Whitney Owens: My pleasure. So I love to talk about silly things first before we get going. Um, so back to the future, I think is a great topic for us to be talking about.
Whitney Owens: So I will just, uh, give my personal confession here. When I was in high school, I literally had this thing called the fox box. It was my Michael J. Fox box. The Fox box. I, I watched back to the Future in my grandmother's room when we were traveling one time and no one else was around. And I don't know, it just got to me and I was like, oh, is he gonna make it?
Whitney Owens: And I'm like crying, like watching back to the future, I was like, oh my gosh, I love this movie. And then I started following him and all the Parkinson's stuff. And so I'm a big fan. In fact, oh, now that we're talking, maybe we should go to New York, cuz you know it's on Broadway now. Yeah. Silly. But. , it's on Broadway.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Back to the future.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. . I wanted to see how they pull off the DeLorean and the flames. That not fantastic. I'll share their Instagram with you cuz that's how I found out about it. I follow them on Instagram. incredible. That's amazing. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. So, and you're, you're a big fan, right? You have a party every
Jane Carter: year?
Jane Carter: Well, I don't, I, I, I have a theme party every year. And this year was back to the future. Ah, it's not a back to the future theme every year, though, one could pull that off if you were really going with like the DeLorean theme, like, Hey, every year we're gonna go back in our DeLorean. But anyway, I, um, but it, it was funny because, um, well, I mean part of it was, uh, we were able, you know, kind of post intense pandemic we're able to go back, get back together.
Jane Carter: So it was back to. Back to the swanky party, but, um, I rewatched back to the future just to kind of get in the spirit of it and get ideas for the party. And that movie is so exciting every single time. It never gets less exciting. They just struck gold with that movie. It's always entertaining and thrilling every time.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. So. That's right. And I know, um, a fun fact about it. I know that, um, pat Flynn. From the Smart Passive Income podcast, that's his like inspiration slash comfort movie that whenever he is writing a book, he just plays that movie over and over and over again for like 36 hours straight while he'll just write because it's just one of those inspiring feelgood movies.
Jane Carter: So yes.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Love it. Well, we could talk, we could talk about your future all day. Um, so, so we'll save that when we get off the air. Okay. So, alright, well I'm looking forward to kind of talking through mindset and, yeah. I don't even just mean like, Mindset is this idea of where do we put our time? Where do we put our energy?
Whitney Owens: Cause I think we talked about this a lot as practice owners. Like, oh, you know, who do I work with and what do I invest in? And figuring out those decisions. But really that deeper level, you know, Jane, you're the one that takes us to the deep levels, like. When it comes to mindset and like, how do I think about myself?
Whitney Owens: How do I think about where to spend my time and energy? Cuz there's just so many things as entrepreneurs that are kind of clamoring for our attention. Um, and I know that's something you've kind of been working through as you're creating your masterminds and things like that, so we'd love to kind of talk through mindset and like, how do you figure out your mindset?
Jane Carter: Hmm. That is a good and huge question. Um, So what I'll start with, well, a a a couple of things that are kind of at the core of what I do and why I do what I do. Um, one is that there is nothing like starting and running a business to make all your stuff come up. , yes, there's nothing like it. Your stuff will come up.
Jane Carter: Um, and, and often it's the. That. And when I say stuff, you know, I mean, your fears, your, your stories, your assumptions about yourself, your shame, all your stuff will come up. And it's often the same stuff that comes up in ar other areas of your life, your relationships, your, you know, your faith, your, you know, it's, it's all the same stuff.
Jane Carter: It's just coming out through the. Um, the vehicle of a business. This is just one more area to work through your stuff. Um, so, so that's one kind of truth about running a business and business mindset is that your stuff is gonna come up, uh, even if you don't think it is, it's coming up . Hmm. Um, and then the other thing is I, and, and this is really at the core of why I do what I do, is that I really, truly believe that your business is here to grow.
Jane Carter: and your business is here to help you. It's a, it's a place to work through your stuff and do things differently. Um, it's an arena to fulfill your potential, you know, to really live out. Like, what, what are you here for? What's your purpose? What lights you up? Um, it's. And it's in that context, it's really, it's not just, okay, what business am I creating?
Jane Carter: But it's really about who do I want to be in my business? Mm-hmm. , you know, so who is, and, and if we put this in a spiritual context, who does God want me to be and how is my business helping shake that? Mm-hmm. , you know, when my stuff comes up, can I see that as a gift from God? So even when it's hard. I get to, I have this great arena to work through that stuff, right?
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. . Um, so yeah, it's, it's, you know, just like your relationship or your environment or, you know, any, anything that we're working on. It's just one more arena where we get shaped and we get changed and where we suffer and struggle, but also have those triumphs and the growth. So I'm going right to the big,
Whitney Owens: the big No, I, you know, I love it.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. And so really our business is shaping us, but God is U kind, kind of God is using our business to shape us and mold us more into what he wants us to be. I mean, there we could go into so many passages about that in scripture about refining us and making us new and, and I totally agree a hundred percent with what you're sharing.
Whitney Owens: Like that's how I have felt in my business over the years. , my stuff comes up and God helps me work through it. Or maybe I run away from it. I do that too. , you know, and, uh, working through those things. Yeah.
Jane Carter: And, and you know, we can go, I'm not saying we aren't gonna go down it, it's possible to go down some unfortunate paths in business.
Jane Carter: Right. Or it could be one more area where we get more entrenched in our old stuff. Um, and a lot of, and, and I think. If you go in with your eyes open, knowing if you, I mean even just that frame of, hey, what if it's possible that this is one arena where God could impact who I am and where I could grow in the ways I wanna grow?
Jane Carter: Um, and that it's not, you know, I mean, for instance, one thing is it isn't just about money, right? Like, but you, it's certainly gonna force you to examine what you believe about money. Right. But we can, I mean, some people have really successful businesses that then create a really unhealthy relationship with money.
Jane Carter: Um, and other people have successful businesses that heal their relationship with money. So I'm trying to track my own thoughts here. Um, I think that's the whole idea is, is being aware of it. Because if you're not thinking of it as, oh, what if. A, a, a playground for my expansion and my growth. It's so easy to just default to either other people's ways of thinking about business or, again, you're your old entrenched ways of thinking about yourself, about God, and about business.
Jane Carter: Does that make sense? Mm-hmm. ? Well, I think sometimes
Whitney Owens: we jump on to everyone else's idea of business because we don't wanna do our own
Jane Carter: work. Oh, totally.
Jane Carter: Yeah. I'm trying. I'm curious. Like I, I can, I'm, I know I've seen lots of examples of this, but like, I'm curious, what are some ways that you immediately think of that that has happened? Oh, just launching
Whitney Owens: on LA not launching latching. Mm-hmm. latching onto what someone else is doing so well, that's what their rates are, so why wouldn't I rate, make my rates the same?
Whitney Owens: Or that's how that practice is running down the street and they're working, so I'm gonna do what they're. And it's not bad to do something that's working, but, but throughout this conversation, what I'm hearing is it's not so much about is this successful? Is this working? What's happening? It's that deeper part of is this aligning with who I am?
Whitney Owens: Is this what I wanna do? Mm-hmm. and does this work for me? Mm-hmm. .
Jane Carter: But at
Whitney Owens: the same time, this does not define. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's where I get stuck, that, that letting your business define you and you, it happens before you even see
Jane Carter: it. Oh my gosh, you are not kidding. Yeah. It's, it, you know, business is a, it's an arena for growth.
Jane Carter: It's also an arena for ego to come in. Mm-hmm. . . And when I say ego, I don't just mean, you know, we tend to think of the like ego of, oh, I'm better than other people. But it's also the flip side of that. Am I good enough? Am I good enough? All that stuff can come in. Mm-hmm. , right? Yeah. And, and back to what you were, you know, what we were saying about, um, trying to do it in the way that others are doing it, so it's totally normal.
Jane Carter: I mean, business is scary, you know, if you're used to a paycheck, You know, you're used to working for someone else. This, it takes a ton of courage to go out on your own, to be depending on yourself, to bring in that paycheck, you know, especially if you have a family to support. Um, so it's really tempting, like people can really get into their fear, right?
Jane Carter: Of just like, I'm just gonna make money. Like, just tell me what to do. Gimme the FivePoint plan. How do I make the money? You know, and, and like there are plenty of coaches that are ready to offer the five point plan and the five point plan, or you know, the 10 point plan or the whatever. It may, it may work for you.
Jane Carter: Um, but sometimes it's just that little sense of security of like, okay, I'm guaranteed to make money if I do it this way, or Yeah, like if I emulate this person who's really successful, I'm guaranteed to make money. And it's, it's acting out of fear. It's not acting intentionally. Um, and it's not always a very self-aware process, so it can end up being.
Jane Carter: Not so good. And I'll use myself as an example. Uh, back when I was getting started with coaching, I, I, I did emulate someone. I saw, like I saw someone who had started this national association for neonatal therapists. It was highly successful. And I was like, oh, that's awesome. I love that model. I wanna do that for counselors in private practice.
Jane Carter: and you know, and it was the time when online businesses, it's, it was still kind of a new thing and it was like taking off and everyone's like, oh, you just plug into this formula and every, you'll make millions of dollars. . It was so, you know, just like passive income was the big buzzword and it was just like, oh, you just, you just follow this plan and everything will be great.
Jane Carter: Um, so, you know, I kind of drank the Kool-Aid and I thought, well, this is gonna be easy. And I did all the things, but I hadn't thought about, wait, is, does this fit who I am? Do I wanna be in front of the computer? You know, 20 hours a day? Am I good at managing large numbers of people? You know, do I know what I'm doing?
Jane Carter: Have I been in the trenches so that I actually know what I'm talking about before I'm trying to create something that's huge and scaled? No. So it didn't go well, and that's okay. It was heartbreaking at the time because a lot of my ego was wrapped up in it. You know, what does this mean about me? That this, that I, you know, I did the formula and it didn't work, and does that mean I'm a failure?
Jane Carter: And, and I know you've heard this story from me before, but it what came out of it, thank God, you know, was that kind of out of the ashes of what at the time I thought of as a failure. Um, out of the ashes came what I currently do. So because I wasn't. It doesn't suit who I am to try to do like a huge scaled membership program.
Jane Carter: Um, so when it bombed, I, I owed people their membership money back , and I was like, well, How about this? Since I don't have any money in my checking account, how about I didn't say that, but I w I just was like, you know what? Even better, I could give you some individual coaching. Um, and thank goodness, um, the, the members I had left said yes to that.
Jane Carter: So I started doing one-on-one coaching and I realized, oh, that really suits me and I'm good at this and this is what I love to do. Mm-hmm. . Um, so. I'm so grateful for that experience cuz I had to learn, all right, this is what I'm not meant to do. I, I do like me just trying to plug into like the trendy formula at the time.
Jane Carter: That is a bad idea and that doesn't work. Mm-hmm. . Um, so I was able to rule that out and then get closer to, oh, this is the direction that I really should be doing this and this is what serves people and also aligns with who I am. Um, so yeah. I, I wish on the front end I'd had a little more depth and guidance to go hold up.
Jane Carter: What, what do I really want this to look like and what really aligns with who I am. But you know, you have to learn through the hard stuff. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. And, and you know, that's what a coach should be helping people with, right? Is not just, here's the three things you should do, but like, what's your motive behind those things?
Whitney Owens: What are you looking for? Um, So I, you saw me looking on my phone here when you were talking, and this is a little, like, gross, but I'm, I shouldn't say gross, I should say doom and gloom really. And I'm gonna go there because I'm, I'm feeling it. Let's go there, . Okay. Do you know what don't drink? The Kool-Aid is from?
Whitney Owens: Oh, yeah,
Jane Carter: I do. Yes. In fact, I, I, in, actually, I, I typically don't use that phrase because. The people who drank the Kool-Aid, they didn't voluntarily drink it. They were held a gun. Mm-hmm. , y'all, let's go to the dark place. Do you wanna tell this story or do you want me to, uh, you,
Whitney Owens: you're gonna do better. I'm just looking on Wikipedia and I actually saw, we have a museum here in Savannah.
Whitney Owens: Uhhuh, . It's, it's kind of weird. It's like, People who were serial killers and stuff like that of museum here. So when you come to the summit, if someone comes to the summit, you can go to the museum. Now. I went down a date with my husband one time and my nanny told me about it. I was like, that is sick. But they have the whole exhibit about, about what it meant.
Whitney Owens: But you, you tell it.
Jane Carter: Cause I think you're gonna do better than me. Oh, well, I, I listened to a podcast about it a few years ago, but yeah, Jim Jones, it was back in the seventies and he had this cult, I'm gonna probably fu, you know, mess up some of the details, but, where? And then they, they went to, was it, was it Papua New Guinea?
Jane Carter: Um, yeah, they went to this compound. Jonestown Jones. Mm-hmm. Town. Um, so thousands of people they go to, or hundreds of people I'm, yeah. Again, the details. Um, but anyway, he has all these people move to this. Obscure, you know, hidden away place. And they, they had this compound and the government was starting to realize, okay, these people are being really being held hostage and they've been brainwashed.
Jane Carter: And, um, and so as, I can't believe we're going, I love that we're doing like, marketing stuff anyway, so, um, the real danger of the following someone else's agenda for you, how about. Um, well that's what
Whitney Owens: I'm thinking about, right? Yeah. Is they drank, they had to drink the Kool-Aid because the government was coming and the guy didn't wanna get caught in all this, and so yeah, they
Jane Carter: all died.
Jane Carter: Well, first he murdered this congressman and a journalist who were investigating it, but then, you know, things were ramped up and they made this, uh, Kool-Aid lace was cyanide and they, uh, they even did like a practice drinking of like, Hey, everybody, we're all. Commit suicide together, and they just to, to make sure people would actually do it.
Jane Carter: And, um, but anyway, they did, they, they, you know, a bunch of people did drink it voluntarily, but then a lot of people were held at gunpoint where they, they, they drank the Kool-Aid and they died. And so by the time the authorities got there, hundreds of people had died. I mean, it was just dead bodies.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. and a few people had escaped and were able to say, Hey, here's what happened. But it started with this incredibly charismatic guy. You know, I mean, God, people love to follow a narcissist to say it , that's another podcast. That's a whole other podcast. But like some people are really good at what they do and, um, but yeah, I mean, you know, I think.
Jane Carter: There's a ton on site, the psychology of people who are susceptible to cults. Um, but you know, I think a lot of it comes out of a deeper fear or out of a, you know, I can't do life on my own. I need someone to tell me how to do it. And so that is a very extreme example of following someone else to your own detriment.
Jane Carter: But it's, you know, it shows up in little ways too when we go, well, what's, what's the trend? What's everyone saying I should do rather than, God has given me a deeper intuition. And yes, I may be new to business. I do need to learn some things. I'll need to learn some skills, but also can I trust my gut that if I, if I'm really willing to get clear on who I'm trying to serve, the impact I'm trying to make, and I'm bringing my own self-awareness that maybe I could create a business that actually reflects that.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. So I was thinking about the emotional, spiritual death. Hmm. When I follow someone else to the point where I'm doing what they do, or people become obsessive of people, they almost die to their own dreams and desires. Mm-hmm. . And, and so then when I think about, don't drink the Kool-Aid, like, don't do what other people are doing simply because they're doing it.
Whitney Owens: Mm-hmm. or you're gonna die to the great things that God has put in you to do. Mm-hmm. , right? Yeah.
Jane Carter: Let me, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, um, I'm gonna flip it to the positive. Thank you. Love that. Okay. Because I'm not, I'm. I'm not gonna do the, like, no, let's talk about positive things, but I just wanna, I think, you know, there's a, there, there's the upside and the shadow side to everything, right?
Jane Carter: So sometimes looking at what someone else is doing can be really great because it can open up the possibility to you that maybe you didn't even know was a thing. You know, I didn't know. Private practice coaching or business coaching was even a thing until I came across my business coach and she knocked my socks off and I was like, oh, this is a whole new way of thinking about things and wow.
Jane Carter: And I wanna do that. You know? So starting out, copying someone or influenced by someone or just seeing what the possibilities are can be really great and even important, you know? So if you think about master paint, , they often start by copying the Masters. Mm-hmm. , right? You, you go to the Louv in France, if you're lucky, and you see all these artists just copying the masters, like re remaking the Mona Lisa, um, or you know, really good jazz musician.
Jane Carter: Well, first they have to learn their scales and first they play all the standards and then they learn how to. and kind of create their own thing. Um, and even, and I know we're gonna, we probably need to do a whole other session on narcissists, but even sometimes following a very charismatic, even narcissistic leader gives people the escape velocity from what they're stuck in.
Jane Carter: Like if they're stuck in a dead end job and they're like, fine, I'll, you know, I'll just work with this person. And, um, and it can, you know, escape velocity is like, what a rocket. Gets to get out of the Earth's gravitational hole. Like sometimes that helps people pull away from where they're really stuck, but then they go, wait a second.
Jane Carter: I'm not in my own orbit now. Now I'm just orbiting them and I need escape velocity from them. So, Even, I mean, I see this in my therapy clients. I see this in coaching that sometimes, um, we latch onto someone else and it helps us get away from whatever rut we're in. But then we go, okay, well now I have to find my own.
Jane Carter: Thing or you know, okay, I'm playing all the, I'm a jazz musician. I'm playing all the standards. I haven't found my own style of music. Now it's time for me to find my own style. Mm-hmm. Like, now it's time for me to like, dip, dip, you know, Scooby deep doop and try to try to scat and do some other jazz. Um, yeah.
Jane Carter: So there are pluses and minuses to our urge to, to look to others. . Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: I love that you brought all that up. Right. Cuz it is that fine line. And I guess that goes back to mindset. It's like, how do I know if I'm doing things? Mm. Just, just what everyone else is doing? Or how do I know it's actually the thing that I need to be doing?
Whitney Owens: How do I know when I'm in the bad orbit, the good orbit, you know? And finding that place.
Jane Carter: Yeah. Yeah. And that I. Some of that is trial and error. Mm-hmm. . Um, some of that is, I mean, I, I, especially with therapists and especially with Christians, , I find that being able to first identify, here's what I don't want.
Jane Carter: Hmm. And to really own that and, and then, and then especially to go, okay, well, what do I want? And to be able to just say that. You know, am I breaking the rules if I want what I want? Like, is this wrong? Just some, you know, therapists love to suffer. , we love this thing of, oh, as you know, if I'm not suffering, then I must be causing someone else pain.
Jane Carter: And so this idea of, oh, I can have what I want. is that, is that okay? You know, that that's a huge thing that I have to work with people to get over of like, no, you can actually want what you want and it can be helping people. Mm-hmm. ,
Whitney Owens: right? Yeah. I like that. So really identifying what it is that we want and don't want.
Whitney Owens: What are our values? What are they not? And if we're following a program or a person or a mantra that's not in line with those things, we can know we're going in the wrong direction. Right?
Jane Carter: Yeah. And can we trust. , can we, can we listen for the still small voice? Mm-hmm. , or if our body is telling us something like, oh, I don't know about this.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. , can we pay attention to that? Yeah. Right. And then, so it's, it's always taking risks. I mean, business involves risk taking. Um, and yet this is all part of the process, right? Like, I think what I get to do as a coach often is to just normalize that and to say, okay, you are fine tuning, you're trying something, and then pendulum is swinging back the other way, and you're overcorrecting and you're trying this, and you're trying that.
Jane Carter: But to be able to say, Hey, guess what? This is okay, this is normal. , like it's normal that sometimes you're gonna cry when you're in business. And it's also normal to want to like have a little bit of a pathway of, oh, can I try these things and celebrate my successes? You know, and yay, good things are happening.
Jane Carter: Or Yay, I made money, what I want, what I love. That's so exciting. Um, but just to even, you know, again, bring it back to, hey, this is all here to grow you. This is all here to help you learn things about your. , even the hard things. Mm-hmm. and so don't freak out. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: You know? Yeah. And I like how you talked about listening to that still small voice and, you know, in a faith-based perspective, we might say the Holy Spirit, you know, speaking to us on, on direction or, um, for me it's a lot of taking things slowly and really being thoughtful about what I'm doing because I tend to wanna rush through things.
Whitney Owens: Oh, I have so many things on a plane, I just wanna tackle all these things so I don't have to do them anymore. You know? Yeah. And, and so bringing it back to, , take a breath, slow down. Where is my mind in this process? What does my body feel in this process? Because I might be embarking on something that's really not me.
Whitney Owens: Yeah.
Jane Carter: And I think that's slowing down and, and again, even checking with your body, it'll help you discern, you know, there's a big difference between, um, I, I'm, I'm excited by this thing, but I'm scared. Right? Mm-hmm. , like, we all know that feeling. I'm really excited, but I'm really scared and we're like squirming and like, ugh, adrenaline, and you know that we know that feeling, right?
Jane Carter: There's also the feeling of I should do this, but it, Ugh. I'm terrified and like, not terrified because I'm excited, but terrified. But terrified because it just feels wrong. Yeah. Right. So use a small, I'm gonna use a really. Small example of this. Um, I mean, obviously I think that applies to big stuff, but even like when reels first came out on Instagram and everyone was like pointing at the text and, and you're doing all these cute reels right now, by the way, and I know that's kind of a newer thing for you and I love watching yours, but there's a difference between like, you see people having fun with it where they.
Jane Carter: Pointing at something or doing a little dance or, you know, costumes or, or just talking on the reels. But, um, they're the people that, you know, they had a social media manager that was like, you have to do reels. You have to point at text. And like their rhythm is off and they look like they've been taken hostage and they're terrifi terrible.
Jane Carter: That's funny. Hear in their eyes and they're like pointing in the corner. And trying to look, you know, be, and you're like, don't, you don't need to do this, don't do this, don't do it because everyone said you should. This is terrible . You know, like there are other ways to do this. So it can be as small as just which kind of marketing tactic you choose.
Jane Carter: Um, but as big as how do I wanna set up my business and is it okay to say I wanna do this, this. Pain. That was the perfect example. ,
Whitney Owens: don't make reels because everyone else is doing it. Doing it cuz you love
Jane Carter: it, do it cuz you now Yeah. If you're intrigued by reels and you're like, oh, I love those, you know, I wanna do it like this person and I w it's really fun.
Jane Carter: Have fun with it.
Whitney Owens: I watched reels forever before I did one. Yeah. Because I was like, oh, they're so fun. I wanna do one that's complicated. .
Jane Carter: Yeah. Yeah. But it came out like, oh, this is fun. Not. Mm-hmm. , someone saying, you have to do this, or your business is gonna fail cuz everybody's doing this.
Whitney Owens: No, there's a lot of other things I could do in my business to make it more successful, but I, I do reels because I need them,
Whitney Owens: I need them to bring fun in my life.
Jane Carter: Okay. Well, and you said the good F word. Um, fun. So another mindset key is that I, I mean, again, this, this brings so much of what I'm trying to say together. Um, if it's aligned with who you are, If the business is, yeah, if the business is aligned with who you are or who you really, truly want to be, um, or your personality and strengths.
Jane Carter: It's fun. It's hard. Um, yeah. Business is hard. Business is dealing with a series of problems that's gonna come up. It's just a, that's a thing, you know? Um, that's a reality. But like, it's, it should be fun. Yeah. And if it's, again, if you feel like if it's sparking your joy, if, if it's aligned, if you know, . If reels look fun and they're fun to make, pursue that, like follow the fun, and you end up creating a business again that that really reflects you and reflects your strengths.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: when I was in college, our professor, I'm sure this is a quote by someone else, but pick a job you love so much, you do it for free. Mm-hmm. and do such a good job that you get paid to do it. Mm-hmm. . And I think that's such a good motto when we're thinking about our business and our work.
Jane Carter: Yes. Yeah.
Jane Carter: And it's gotta be fun because it's gonna be hard. Mm-hmm. definitely. And cause you're gonna cry . I don't wanna scare anyone. But you know, it's hard sometimes, or, and they're gonna be those tedious times. You know, I, I, um, I heard a blog post once about this, but, you know, we, I love movies. You love movies. We love Back to the Future.
Jane Carter: Um, you know, in, in a lot of movies, especially like in the eighties and stuff, they'd have a montage. Mm-hmm. , you know, so like Karate Kid, you know, you're the best around and they're doing the whole. The montage of the tournament or like the montage of the training. Montages are there to keep it exciting and they leave out the parts where they're like, oh, my muscles are sore, or Oh, I'm doing the same thing over and over again for the 5000th time.
Jane Carter: Right. Yeah. Like with business, yeah. There're gonna be times of being tedious and there're gonna be times where it's hard and it's challenging and it's, you know, you, you feel kind of lost. Mm-hmm. or we have some failures, right? Mm-hmm. , that's, that's a reality. But it helps. If you can look at it, it's okay, but there's this larger montage of, this is me getting to that point of winning the tournament.
Jane Carter: This is getting me to that point of like, I'm having enough moments of, I'm so lit up by this work. I'm so, I love this. I'm having so much fun. Like each of these challenges, they're hard, but once I overcome it, I feel so good. Right. ?
Whitney Owens: Yeah. I think you just inspired a reel for me. . .
Jane Carter: I'm so glad. I think you, you and I have better conversations because we're having fun, right,
Jane Carter: That's right. That's right. So, so, I mean, I tell my clients all the time, like, find the fun or like, you know. Mm-hmm. , if you're thinking about how to do your marketing plan, we'll first figure out, you know, even if they're scary to you, find out, you know, what's fun to do so that you'll do. Yeah, because otherwise you'll put it on your to-do list and you won't get around to it.
Jane Carter: You'll, you know, rearrange your junk drawer five times and you'll, you know, organize your office and you'll find all these ex you'll check your email all day and you'll, you'll find excuses not to actually do the marketing, so, oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, Jane, this has been fun, . We talked about cults, we talked about back to the future.
Whitney Owens: Yes, we did. Well, tell me, somebody is gonna be listening right now thinking, man, I need a coach that not only tells me or gives advice, not necessarily tells me what to do, but gives me advice. But I really need a coach that understands me and my mindsets and the deeper stuff. And so they're thinking they want to talk to Jane Carter
Whitney Owens: Um, so how do
Jane Carter: they get in touch with you? Uh, the best thing would be go to my website, Jane Carter coaching.com, um, or you can email me, Jane Jane Carter coaching.com. Um, Uh, yeah, I, I, I do individual work, work with clients and I'm probably gonna be offering some little, like, retreats and stuff in the next few months.
Jane Carter: But, um, I also have a, a mighty Mastermind that is a nine month intensive. Super fun, awesome program that starts in the fall. Um, so yeah, just reach out to me and get on my email list. I like to send out fun stories, uh, every week and with little coaching lessons in them. Um, so get on my list cuz I will, will be in touch that way too.
Jane Carter: Yes.
Whitney Owens: Wonderful. And Jane has one of the best email lists. In fact, another consultant was like, oh, you need to get on Jane's list. I was like, oh, okay. And I got on Jane's list and I was like, man, I gotta tell other people get on her list. So yeah, so if you're listening, you're not on Jane's List, get on there cuz it's a good one.
Whitney Owens: Um, you do. Really fun, quirky things and I just enjoy them cuz they're not boring. .
Jane Carter: That's, that's the goal. That's
Whitney Owens: right. That's right. And helpful. Interesting and helpful. Um, so anything else that we missed out that you wanted to make sure to let people
Jane Carter: know about? Um, okay. My, my last little mindset, it's not little, it's, it's one of my li like big mindset mi mindsets to, to carry with you.
Jane Carter: I want you to realize that your business is pulling for you. Hmm. I really like thinking of it that way. You know, along the lines of your business is here to grow you and to expand you and, and yes, to bring you money and to bring you, you know, clients and, and fulfilling work. Um, your business is pulling for you.
Jane Carter: It's not out to get you. It's not here to make you suffer. Um, it's, it's here to, it's here. Make you into your best self. Hmm. And if your business is currently not feeling like it's making you into your best self and it, it feels like it's out to get you instead of pulling for you, get some help with that.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. , because it, for you.
Whitney Owens: Yeah, it's pulling for me.
Jane Carter: I love it. Your business is your friend. Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Well, Jane, it's always my pleasure to have you on the podcast, so hopefully there'll be many more years of podcasting, friendship, and interviews.
Jane Carter: Oh, I sure hope so, cuz this is a blast. So, all right, thanks.WP 23 | Mindset Kool-Aid (the good kind & the bad) with Jane Carter
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Whitney Owens: Welcome back to The Wise Practice Podcast. I'm really looking forward to hanging out with you guys today and for our special guest, Jane Carter. The Jane Carter coaching. Not only is she an amazing coach, but has been a dear friend of mine over the years, as she has been a support and a strength for me through many ups and downs in personal life and business.
Whitney Owens: So I'm excited to introduce you guys to her. So Jane is located in Asheville, North Carolina in the beautiful. Mountains. Not only is she a professional counselor and sees clients in her private practice, but she is also a coach going on eight plus years of coaching therapists. So when I think of Jane, I feel like she was on the cutting edge when coaching started in the private practice world.
Whitney Owens: And so I feel honored to be able to have her on the show today. So
Jane Carter: how you doing? Oh, great. I'm so glad to be back on the show.
Whitney Owens: Yay.
Jane Carter: Yeah. Well it's so great to talk to you again too. Cause our friendship really started with a podcast episode. It was the first time we had talked and it's been so fun to develop this friendship.
Jane Carter: So, yay. I'm glad to be.
Whitney Owens: Yes. Oh, gosh. Well, I appreciate you saying that. That reminds me, I remember you emailed me and was like, Hey, I heard about you threw somebody, and your podcast is awesome. I'd love to come on the show. And I remember thinking, oh my gosh, Jane Carter wants to come on my show. Like, I thought I was the coolest thing ever.
Whitney Owens: And so I just love that, that we've developed that friendship.
Jane Carter: I know. Yay. And I'll add, you've seen, seen me through some ups and downs in the, in the last year or so. Yes. Whitney's.
Whitney Owens: My pleasure. So I love to talk about silly things first before we get going. Um, so back to the future, I think is a great topic for us to be talking about.
Whitney Owens: So I will just, uh, give my personal confession here. When I was in high school, I literally had this thing called the fox box. It was my Michael J. Fox box. The Fox box. I, I watched back to the Future in my grandmother's room when we were traveling one time and no one else was around. And I don't know, it just got to me and I was like, oh, is he gonna make it?
Whitney Owens: And I'm like crying, like watching back to the future, I was like, oh my gosh, I love this movie. And then I started following him and all the Parkinson's stuff. And so I'm a big fan. In fact, oh, now that we're talking, maybe we should go to New York, cuz you know it's on Broadway now. Yeah. Silly. But. , it's on Broadway.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Back to the future.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. . I wanted to see how they pull off the DeLorean and the flames. That not fantastic. I'll share their Instagram with you cuz that's how I found out about it. I follow them on Instagram. incredible. That's amazing. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. So, and you're, you're a big fan, right? You have a party every
Jane Carter: year?
Jane Carter: Well, I don't, I, I, I have a theme party every year. And this year was back to the future. Ah, it's not a back to the future theme every year, though, one could pull that off if you were really going with like the DeLorean theme, like, Hey, every year we're gonna go back in our DeLorean. But anyway, I, um, but it, it was funny because, um, well, I mean part of it was, uh, we were able, you know, kind of post intense pandemic we're able to go back, get back together.
Jane Carter: So it was back to. Back to the swanky party, but, um, I rewatched back to the future just to kind of get in the spirit of it and get ideas for the party. And that movie is so exciting every single time. It never gets less exciting. They just struck gold with that movie. It's always entertaining and thrilling every time.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. So. That's right. And I know, um, a fun fact about it. I know that, um, pat Flynn. From the Smart Passive Income podcast, that's his like inspiration slash comfort movie that whenever he is writing a book, he just plays that movie over and over and over again for like 36 hours straight while he'll just write because it's just one of those inspiring feelgood movies.
Jane Carter: So yes.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Love it. Well, we could talk, we could talk about your future all day. Um, so, so we'll save that when we get off the air. Okay. So, alright, well I'm looking forward to kind of talking through mindset and, yeah. I don't even just mean like, Mindset is this idea of where do we put our time? Where do we put our energy?
Whitney Owens: Cause I think we talked about this a lot as practice owners. Like, oh, you know, who do I work with and what do I invest in? And figuring out those decisions. But really that deeper level, you know, Jane, you're the one that takes us to the deep levels, like. When it comes to mindset and like, how do I think about myself?
Whitney Owens: How do I think about where to spend my time and energy? Cuz there's just so many things as entrepreneurs that are kind of clamoring for our attention. Um, and I know that's something you've kind of been working through as you're creating your masterminds and things like that, so we'd love to kind of talk through mindset and like, how do you figure out your mindset?
Jane Carter: Hmm. That is a good and huge question. Um, So what I'll start with, well, a a a couple of things that are kind of at the core of what I do and why I do what I do. Um, one is that there is nothing like starting and running a business to make all your stuff come up. , yes, there's nothing like it. Your stuff will come up.
Jane Carter: Um, and, and often it's the. That. And when I say stuff, you know, I mean, your fears, your, your stories, your assumptions about yourself, your shame, all your stuff will come up. And it's often the same stuff that comes up in ar other areas of your life, your relationships, your, you know, your faith, your, you know, it's, it's all the same stuff.
Jane Carter: It's just coming out through the. Um, the vehicle of a business. This is just one more area to work through your stuff. Um, so, so that's one kind of truth about running a business and business mindset is that your stuff is gonna come up, uh, even if you don't think it is, it's coming up . Hmm. Um, and then the other thing is I, and, and this is really at the core of why I do what I do, is that I really, truly believe that your business is here to grow.
Jane Carter: and your business is here to help you. It's a, it's a place to work through your stuff and do things differently. Um, it's an arena to fulfill your potential, you know, to really live out. Like, what, what are you here for? What's your purpose? What lights you up? Um, it's. And it's in that context, it's really, it's not just, okay, what business am I creating?
Jane Carter: But it's really about who do I want to be in my business? Mm-hmm. , you know, so who is, and, and if we put this in a spiritual context, who does God want me to be and how is my business helping shake that? Mm-hmm. , you know, when my stuff comes up, can I see that as a gift from God? So even when it's hard. I get to, I have this great arena to work through that stuff, right?
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. . Um, so yeah, it's, it's, you know, just like your relationship or your environment or, you know, any, anything that we're working on. It's just one more arena where we get shaped and we get changed and where we suffer and struggle, but also have those triumphs and the growth. So I'm going right to the big,
Whitney Owens: the big No, I, you know, I love it.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. And so really our business is shaping us, but God is U kind, kind of God is using our business to shape us and mold us more into what he wants us to be. I mean, there we could go into so many passages about that in scripture about refining us and making us new and, and I totally agree a hundred percent with what you're sharing.
Whitney Owens: Like that's how I have felt in my business over the years. , my stuff comes up and God helps me work through it. Or maybe I run away from it. I do that too. , you know, and, uh, working through those things. Yeah.
Jane Carter: And, and you know, we can go, I'm not saying we aren't gonna go down it, it's possible to go down some unfortunate paths in business.
Jane Carter: Right. Or it could be one more area where we get more entrenched in our old stuff. Um, and a lot of, and, and I think. If you go in with your eyes open, knowing if you, I mean even just that frame of, hey, what if it's possible that this is one arena where God could impact who I am and where I could grow in the ways I wanna grow?
Jane Carter: Um, and that it's not, you know, I mean, for instance, one thing is it isn't just about money, right? Like, but you, it's certainly gonna force you to examine what you believe about money. Right. But we can, I mean, some people have really successful businesses that then create a really unhealthy relationship with money.
Jane Carter: Um, and other people have successful businesses that heal their relationship with money. So I'm trying to track my own thoughts here. Um, I think that's the whole idea is, is being aware of it. Because if you're not thinking of it as, oh, what if. A, a, a playground for my expansion and my growth. It's so easy to just default to either other people's ways of thinking about business or, again, you're your old entrenched ways of thinking about yourself, about God, and about business.
Jane Carter: Does that make sense? Mm-hmm. ? Well, I think sometimes
Whitney Owens: we jump on to everyone else's idea of business because we don't wanna do our own
Jane Carter: work. Oh, totally.
Jane Carter: Yeah. I'm trying. I'm curious. Like I, I can, I'm, I know I've seen lots of examples of this, but like, I'm curious, what are some ways that you immediately think of that that has happened? Oh, just launching
Whitney Owens: on LA not launching latching. Mm-hmm. latching onto what someone else is doing so well, that's what their rates are, so why wouldn't I rate, make my rates the same?
Whitney Owens: Or that's how that practice is running down the street and they're working, so I'm gonna do what they're. And it's not bad to do something that's working, but, but throughout this conversation, what I'm hearing is it's not so much about is this successful? Is this working? What's happening? It's that deeper part of is this aligning with who I am?
Whitney Owens: Is this what I wanna do? Mm-hmm. and does this work for me? Mm-hmm. .
Jane Carter: But at
Whitney Owens: the same time, this does not define. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's where I get stuck, that, that letting your business define you and you, it happens before you even see
Jane Carter: it. Oh my gosh, you are not kidding. Yeah. It's, it, you know, business is a, it's an arena for growth.
Jane Carter: It's also an arena for ego to come in. Mm-hmm. . . And when I say ego, I don't just mean, you know, we tend to think of the like ego of, oh, I'm better than other people. But it's also the flip side of that. Am I good enough? Am I good enough? All that stuff can come in. Mm-hmm. , right? Yeah. And, and back to what you were, you know, what we were saying about, um, trying to do it in the way that others are doing it, so it's totally normal.
Jane Carter: I mean, business is scary, you know, if you're used to a paycheck, You know, you're used to working for someone else. This, it takes a ton of courage to go out on your own, to be depending on yourself, to bring in that paycheck, you know, especially if you have a family to support. Um, so it's really tempting, like people can really get into their fear, right?
Jane Carter: Of just like, I'm just gonna make money. Like, just tell me what to do. Gimme the FivePoint plan. How do I make the money? You know, and, and like there are plenty of coaches that are ready to offer the five point plan and the five point plan, or you know, the 10 point plan or the whatever. It may, it may work for you.
Jane Carter: Um, but sometimes it's just that little sense of security of like, okay, I'm guaranteed to make money if I do it this way, or Yeah, like if I emulate this person who's really successful, I'm guaranteed to make money. And it's, it's acting out of fear. It's not acting intentionally. Um, and it's not always a very self-aware process, so it can end up being.
Jane Carter: Not so good. And I'll use myself as an example. Uh, back when I was getting started with coaching, I, I, I did emulate someone. I saw, like I saw someone who had started this national association for neonatal therapists. It was highly successful. And I was like, oh, that's awesome. I love that model. I wanna do that for counselors in private practice.
Jane Carter: and you know, and it was the time when online businesses, it's, it was still kind of a new thing and it was like taking off and everyone's like, oh, you just plug into this formula and every, you'll make millions of dollars. . It was so, you know, just like passive income was the big buzzword and it was just like, oh, you just, you just follow this plan and everything will be great.
Jane Carter: Um, so, you know, I kind of drank the Kool-Aid and I thought, well, this is gonna be easy. And I did all the things, but I hadn't thought about, wait, is, does this fit who I am? Do I wanna be in front of the computer? You know, 20 hours a day? Am I good at managing large numbers of people? You know, do I know what I'm doing?
Jane Carter: Have I been in the trenches so that I actually know what I'm talking about before I'm trying to create something that's huge and scaled? No. So it didn't go well, and that's okay. It was heartbreaking at the time because a lot of my ego was wrapped up in it. You know, what does this mean about me? That this, that I, you know, I did the formula and it didn't work, and does that mean I'm a failure?
Jane Carter: And, and I know you've heard this story from me before, but it what came out of it, thank God, you know, was that kind of out of the ashes of what at the time I thought of as a failure. Um, out of the ashes came what I currently do. So because I wasn't. It doesn't suit who I am to try to do like a huge scaled membership program.
Jane Carter: Um, so when it bombed, I, I owed people their membership money back , and I was like, well, How about this? Since I don't have any money in my checking account, how about I didn't say that, but I w I just was like, you know what? Even better, I could give you some individual coaching. Um, and thank goodness, um, the, the members I had left said yes to that.
Jane Carter: So I started doing one-on-one coaching and I realized, oh, that really suits me and I'm good at this and this is what I love to do. Mm-hmm. . Um, so. I'm so grateful for that experience cuz I had to learn, all right, this is what I'm not meant to do. I, I do like me just trying to plug into like the trendy formula at the time.
Jane Carter: That is a bad idea and that doesn't work. Mm-hmm. . Um, so I was able to rule that out and then get closer to, oh, this is the direction that I really should be doing this and this is what serves people and also aligns with who I am. Um, so yeah. I, I wish on the front end I'd had a little more depth and guidance to go hold up.
Jane Carter: What, what do I really want this to look like and what really aligns with who I am. But you know, you have to learn through the hard stuff. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. And, and you know, that's what a coach should be helping people with, right? Is not just, here's the three things you should do, but like, what's your motive behind those things?
Whitney Owens: What are you looking for? Um, So I, you saw me looking on my phone here when you were talking, and this is a little, like, gross, but I'm, I shouldn't say gross, I should say doom and gloom really. And I'm gonna go there because I'm, I'm feeling it. Let's go there, . Okay. Do you know what don't drink? The Kool-Aid is from?
Whitney Owens: Oh, yeah,
Jane Carter: I do. Yes. In fact, I, I, in, actually, I, I typically don't use that phrase because. The people who drank the Kool-Aid, they didn't voluntarily drink it. They were held a gun. Mm-hmm. , y'all, let's go to the dark place. Do you wanna tell this story or do you want me to, uh, you,
Whitney Owens: you're gonna do better. I'm just looking on Wikipedia and I actually saw, we have a museum here in Savannah.
Whitney Owens: Uhhuh, . It's, it's kind of weird. It's like, People who were serial killers and stuff like that of museum here. So when you come to the summit, if someone comes to the summit, you can go to the museum. Now. I went down a date with my husband one time and my nanny told me about it. I was like, that is sick. But they have the whole exhibit about, about what it meant.
Whitney Owens: But you, you tell it.
Jane Carter: Cause I think you're gonna do better than me. Oh, well, I, I listened to a podcast about it a few years ago, but yeah, Jim Jones, it was back in the seventies and he had this cult, I'm gonna probably fu, you know, mess up some of the details, but, where? And then they, they went to, was it, was it Papua New Guinea?
Jane Carter: Um, yeah, they went to this compound. Jonestown Jones. Mm-hmm. Town. Um, so thousands of people they go to, or hundreds of people I'm, yeah. Again, the details. Um, but anyway, he has all these people move to this. Obscure, you know, hidden away place. And they, they had this compound and the government was starting to realize, okay, these people are being really being held hostage and they've been brainwashed.
Jane Carter: And, um, and so as, I can't believe we're going, I love that we're doing like, marketing stuff anyway, so, um, the real danger of the following someone else's agenda for you, how about. Um, well that's what
Whitney Owens: I'm thinking about, right? Yeah. Is they drank, they had to drink the Kool-Aid because the government was coming and the guy didn't wanna get caught in all this, and so yeah, they
Jane Carter: all died.
Jane Carter: Well, first he murdered this congressman and a journalist who were investigating it, but then, you know, things were ramped up and they made this, uh, Kool-Aid lace was cyanide and they, uh, they even did like a practice drinking of like, Hey, everybody, we're all. Commit suicide together, and they just to, to make sure people would actually do it.
Jane Carter: And, um, but anyway, they did, they, they, you know, a bunch of people did drink it voluntarily, but then a lot of people were held at gunpoint where they, they, they drank the Kool-Aid and they died. And so by the time the authorities got there, hundreds of people had died. I mean, it was just dead bodies.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. and a few people had escaped and were able to say, Hey, here's what happened. But it started with this incredibly charismatic guy. You know, I mean, God, people love to follow a narcissist to say it , that's another podcast. That's a whole other podcast. But like some people are really good at what they do and, um, but yeah, I mean, you know, I think.
Jane Carter: There's a ton on site, the psychology of people who are susceptible to cults. Um, but you know, I think a lot of it comes out of a deeper fear or out of a, you know, I can't do life on my own. I need someone to tell me how to do it. And so that is a very extreme example of following someone else to your own detriment.
Jane Carter: But it's, you know, it shows up in little ways too when we go, well, what's, what's the trend? What's everyone saying I should do rather than, God has given me a deeper intuition. And yes, I may be new to business. I do need to learn some things. I'll need to learn some skills, but also can I trust my gut that if I, if I'm really willing to get clear on who I'm trying to serve, the impact I'm trying to make, and I'm bringing my own self-awareness that maybe I could create a business that actually reflects that.
Whitney Owens: Yeah. So I was thinking about the emotional, spiritual death. Hmm. When I follow someone else to the point where I'm doing what they do, or people become obsessive of people, they almost die to their own dreams and desires. Mm-hmm. . And, and so then when I think about, don't drink the Kool-Aid, like, don't do what other people are doing simply because they're doing it.
Whitney Owens: Mm-hmm. or you're gonna die to the great things that God has put in you to do. Mm-hmm. , right? Yeah.
Jane Carter: Let me, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, um, I'm gonna flip it to the positive. Thank you. Love that. Okay. Because I'm not, I'm. I'm not gonna do the, like, no, let's talk about positive things, but I just wanna, I think, you know, there's a, there, there's the upside and the shadow side to everything, right?
Jane Carter: So sometimes looking at what someone else is doing can be really great because it can open up the possibility to you that maybe you didn't even know was a thing. You know, I didn't know. Private practice coaching or business coaching was even a thing until I came across my business coach and she knocked my socks off and I was like, oh, this is a whole new way of thinking about things and wow.
Jane Carter: And I wanna do that. You know? So starting out, copying someone or influenced by someone or just seeing what the possibilities are can be really great and even important, you know? So if you think about master paint, , they often start by copying the Masters. Mm-hmm. , right? You, you go to the Louv in France, if you're lucky, and you see all these artists just copying the masters, like re remaking the Mona Lisa, um, or you know, really good jazz musician.
Jane Carter: Well, first they have to learn their scales and first they play all the standards and then they learn how to. and kind of create their own thing. Um, and even, and I know we're gonna, we probably need to do a whole other session on narcissists, but even sometimes following a very charismatic, even narcissistic leader gives people the escape velocity from what they're stuck in.
Jane Carter: Like if they're stuck in a dead end job and they're like, fine, I'll, you know, I'll just work with this person. And, um, and it can, you know, escape velocity is like, what a rocket. Gets to get out of the Earth's gravitational hole. Like sometimes that helps people pull away from where they're really stuck, but then they go, wait a second.
Jane Carter: I'm not in my own orbit now. Now I'm just orbiting them and I need escape velocity from them. So, Even, I mean, I see this in my therapy clients. I see this in coaching that sometimes, um, we latch onto someone else and it helps us get away from whatever rut we're in. But then we go, okay, well now I have to find my own.
Jane Carter: Thing or you know, okay, I'm playing all the, I'm a jazz musician. I'm playing all the standards. I haven't found my own style of music. Now it's time for me to find my own style. Mm-hmm. Like, now it's time for me to like, dip, dip, you know, Scooby deep doop and try to try to scat and do some other jazz. Um, yeah.
Jane Carter: So there are pluses and minuses to our urge to, to look to others. . Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: I love that you brought all that up. Right. Cuz it is that fine line. And I guess that goes back to mindset. It's like, how do I know if I'm doing things? Mm. Just, just what everyone else is doing? Or how do I know it's actually the thing that I need to be doing?
Whitney Owens: How do I know when I'm in the bad orbit, the good orbit, you know? And finding that place.
Jane Carter: Yeah. Yeah. And that I. Some of that is trial and error. Mm-hmm. . Um, some of that is, I mean, I, I, especially with therapists and especially with Christians, , I find that being able to first identify, here's what I don't want.
Jane Carter: Hmm. And to really own that and, and then, and then especially to go, okay, well, what do I want? And to be able to just say that. You know, am I breaking the rules if I want what I want? Like, is this wrong? Just some, you know, therapists love to suffer. , we love this thing of, oh, as you know, if I'm not suffering, then I must be causing someone else pain.
Jane Carter: And so this idea of, oh, I can have what I want. is that, is that okay? You know, that that's a huge thing that I have to work with people to get over of like, no, you can actually want what you want and it can be helping people. Mm-hmm. ,
Whitney Owens: right? Yeah. I like that. So really identifying what it is that we want and don't want.
Whitney Owens: What are our values? What are they not? And if we're following a program or a person or a mantra that's not in line with those things, we can know we're going in the wrong direction. Right?
Jane Carter: Yeah. And can we trust. , can we, can we listen for the still small voice? Mm-hmm. , or if our body is telling us something like, oh, I don't know about this.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. , can we pay attention to that? Yeah. Right. And then, so it's, it's always taking risks. I mean, business involves risk taking. Um, and yet this is all part of the process, right? Like, I think what I get to do as a coach often is to just normalize that and to say, okay, you are fine tuning, you're trying something, and then pendulum is swinging back the other way, and you're overcorrecting and you're trying this, and you're trying that.
Jane Carter: But to be able to say, Hey, guess what? This is okay, this is normal. , like it's normal that sometimes you're gonna cry when you're in business. And it's also normal to want to like have a little bit of a pathway of, oh, can I try these things and celebrate my successes? You know, and yay, good things are happening.
Jane Carter: Or Yay, I made money, what I want, what I love. That's so exciting. Um, but just to even, you know, again, bring it back to, hey, this is all here to grow you. This is all here to help you learn things about your. , even the hard things. Mm-hmm. and so don't freak out. Yeah.
Whitney Owens: You know? Yeah. And I like how you talked about listening to that still small voice and, you know, in a faith-based perspective, we might say the Holy Spirit, you know, speaking to us on, on direction or, um, for me it's a lot of taking things slowly and really being thoughtful about what I'm doing because I tend to wanna rush through things.
Whitney Owens: Oh, I have so many things on a plane, I just wanna tackle all these things so I don't have to do them anymore. You know? Yeah. And, and so bringing it back to, , take a breath, slow down. Where is my mind in this process? What does my body feel in this process? Because I might be embarking on something that's really not me.
Whitney Owens: Yeah.
Jane Carter: And I think that's slowing down and, and again, even checking with your body, it'll help you discern, you know, there's a big difference between, um, I, I'm, I'm excited by this thing, but I'm scared. Right? Mm-hmm. , like, we all know that feeling. I'm really excited, but I'm really scared and we're like squirming and like, ugh, adrenaline, and you know that we know that feeling, right?
Jane Carter: There's also the feeling of I should do this, but it, Ugh. I'm terrified and like, not terrified because I'm excited, but terrified. But terrified because it just feels wrong. Yeah. Right. So use a small, I'm gonna use a really. Small example of this. Um, I mean, obviously I think that applies to big stuff, but even like when reels first came out on Instagram and everyone was like pointing at the text and, and you're doing all these cute reels right now, by the way, and I know that's kind of a newer thing for you and I love watching yours, but there's a difference between like, you see people having fun with it where they.
Jane Carter: Pointing at something or doing a little dance or, you know, costumes or, or just talking on the reels. But, um, they're the people that, you know, they had a social media manager that was like, you have to do reels. You have to point at text. And like their rhythm is off and they look like they've been taken hostage and they're terrifi terrible.
Jane Carter: That's funny. Hear in their eyes and they're like pointing in the corner. And trying to look, you know, be, and you're like, don't, you don't need to do this, don't do this, don't do it because everyone said you should. This is terrible . You know, like there are other ways to do this. So it can be as small as just which kind of marketing tactic you choose.
Jane Carter: Um, but as big as how do I wanna set up my business and is it okay to say I wanna do this, this. Pain. That was the perfect example. ,
Whitney Owens: don't make reels because everyone else is doing it. Doing it cuz you love
Jane Carter: it, do it cuz you now Yeah. If you're intrigued by reels and you're like, oh, I love those, you know, I wanna do it like this person and I w it's really fun.
Jane Carter: Have fun with it.
Whitney Owens: I watched reels forever before I did one. Yeah. Because I was like, oh, they're so fun. I wanna do one that's complicated. .
Jane Carter: Yeah. Yeah. But it came out like, oh, this is fun. Not. Mm-hmm. , someone saying, you have to do this, or your business is gonna fail cuz everybody's doing this.
Whitney Owens: No, there's a lot of other things I could do in my business to make it more successful, but I, I do reels because I need them,
Whitney Owens: I need them to bring fun in my life.
Jane Carter: Okay. Well, and you said the good F word. Um, fun. So another mindset key is that I, I mean, again, this, this brings so much of what I'm trying to say together. Um, if it's aligned with who you are, If the business is, yeah, if the business is aligned with who you are or who you really, truly want to be, um, or your personality and strengths.
Jane Carter: It's fun. It's hard. Um, yeah. Business is hard. Business is dealing with a series of problems that's gonna come up. It's just a, that's a thing, you know? Um, that's a reality. But like, it's, it should be fun. Yeah. And if it's, again, if you feel like if it's sparking your joy, if, if it's aligned, if you know, . If reels look fun and they're fun to make, pursue that, like follow the fun, and you end up creating a business again that that really reflects you and reflects your strengths.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: when I was in college, our professor, I'm sure this is a quote by someone else, but pick a job you love so much, you do it for free. Mm-hmm. and do such a good job that you get paid to do it. Mm-hmm. . And I think that's such a good motto when we're thinking about our business and our work.
Jane Carter: Yes. Yeah.
Jane Carter: And it's gotta be fun because it's gonna be hard. Mm-hmm. definitely. And cause you're gonna cry . I don't wanna scare anyone. But you know, it's hard sometimes, or, and they're gonna be those tedious times. You know, I, I, um, I heard a blog post once about this, but, you know, we, I love movies. You love movies. We love Back to the Future.
Jane Carter: Um, you know, in, in a lot of movies, especially like in the eighties and stuff, they'd have a montage. Mm-hmm. , you know, so like Karate Kid, you know, you're the best around and they're doing the whole. The montage of the tournament or like the montage of the training. Montages are there to keep it exciting and they leave out the parts where they're like, oh, my muscles are sore, or Oh, I'm doing the same thing over and over again for the 5000th time.
Jane Carter: Right. Yeah. Like with business, yeah. There're gonna be times of being tedious and there're gonna be times where it's hard and it's challenging and it's, you know, you, you feel kind of lost. Mm-hmm. or we have some failures, right? Mm-hmm. , that's, that's a reality. But it helps. If you can look at it, it's okay, but there's this larger montage of, this is me getting to that point of winning the tournament.
Jane Carter: This is getting me to that point of like, I'm having enough moments of, I'm so lit up by this work. I'm so, I love this. I'm having so much fun. Like each of these challenges, they're hard, but once I overcome it, I feel so good. Right. ?
Whitney Owens: Yeah. I think you just inspired a reel for me. . .
Jane Carter: I'm so glad. I think you, you and I have better conversations because we're having fun, right,
Jane Carter: That's right. That's right. So, so, I mean, I tell my clients all the time, like, find the fun or like, you know. Mm-hmm. , if you're thinking about how to do your marketing plan, we'll first figure out, you know, even if they're scary to you, find out, you know, what's fun to do so that you'll do. Yeah, because otherwise you'll put it on your to-do list and you won't get around to it.
Jane Carter: You'll, you know, rearrange your junk drawer five times and you'll, you know, organize your office and you'll find all these ex you'll check your email all day and you'll, you'll find excuses not to actually do the marketing, so, oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, Jane, this has been fun, . We talked about cults, we talked about back to the future.
Whitney Owens: Yes, we did. Well, tell me, somebody is gonna be listening right now thinking, man, I need a coach that not only tells me or gives advice, not necessarily tells me what to do, but gives me advice. But I really need a coach that understands me and my mindsets and the deeper stuff. And so they're thinking they want to talk to Jane Carter
Whitney Owens: Um, so how do
Jane Carter: they get in touch with you? Uh, the best thing would be go to my website, Jane Carter coaching.com, um, or you can email me, Jane Jane Carter coaching.com. Um, Uh, yeah, I, I, I do individual work, work with clients and I'm probably gonna be offering some little, like, retreats and stuff in the next few months.
Jane Carter: But, um, I also have a, a mighty Mastermind that is a nine month intensive. Super fun, awesome program that starts in the fall. Um, so yeah, just reach out to me and get on my email list. I like to send out fun stories, uh, every week and with little coaching lessons in them. Um, so get on my list cuz I will, will be in touch that way too.
Jane Carter: Yes.
Whitney Owens: Wonderful. And Jane has one of the best email lists. In fact, another consultant was like, oh, you need to get on Jane's list. I was like, oh, okay. And I got on Jane's list and I was like, man, I gotta tell other people get on her list. So yeah, so if you're listening, you're not on Jane's List, get on there cuz it's a good one.
Whitney Owens: Um, you do. Really fun, quirky things and I just enjoy them cuz they're not boring. .
Jane Carter: That's, that's the goal. That's
Whitney Owens: right. That's right. And helpful. Interesting and helpful. Um, so anything else that we missed out that you wanted to make sure to let people
Jane Carter: know about? Um, okay. My, my last little mindset, it's not little, it's, it's one of my li like big mindset mi mindsets to, to carry with you.
Jane Carter: I want you to realize that your business is pulling for you. Hmm. I really like thinking of it that way. You know, along the lines of your business is here to grow you and to expand you and, and yes, to bring you money and to bring you, you know, clients and, and fulfilling work. Um, your business is pulling for you.
Jane Carter: It's not out to get you. It's not here to make you suffer. Um, it's, it's here to, it's here. Make you into your best self. Hmm. And if your business is currently not feeling like it's making you into your best self and it, it feels like it's out to get you instead of pulling for you, get some help with that.
Jane Carter: Mm-hmm. , because it, for you.
Whitney Owens: Yeah, it's pulling for me.
Jane Carter: I love it. Your business is your friend. Mm-hmm. .
Whitney Owens: Yeah. Well, Jane, it's always my pleasure to have you on the podcast, so hopefully there'll be many more years of podcasting, friendship, and interviews.
Jane Carter: Oh, I sure hope so, cuz this is a blast. So, all right, thanks.
Show Notes and Audio Production by James Marland
